Dorothy Spivey (primary interviewee) and Bill Spivey interview recording, circa 1993-1997

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Grace	[indistinct 00:00:09]. Are you ready?	0:00
Bill Spivey	Yeah. [indistinct 00:00:11]. It's more like [indistinct 00:00:11] down here.	0:00
Grace	Okay.	0:00
Bill Spivey	You ready?	0:10
Grace	Yeah. Do you want to [indistinct 00:00:24] in the name of [indistinct 00:00:26].	0:12
Bill Spivey	Yeah. If we can just [indistinct 00:00:29].	0:13
Speaker 3	State your names for the record.	0:13
Dorothy Spivey	Well, I'm Dorothy [indistinct 00:00:39]. Well, that's not necessary.	0:33
Grace	That's good enough. That's you. That's you.	0:42
Bill Spivey	Oh, we can [indistinct 00:00:43].	0:42
Grace	Okay. Bill, I'm [indistinct 00:00:43] you with some of the life [indistinct 00:00:57] to the old James City.	0:42
Bill Spivey	I would. The last?	0:57
Grace	The last one.	0:57
Bill Spivey	I would be there for [indistinct 00:01:03]. They're all had [indistinct 00:01:04] past. [indistinct 00:01:09] he pass what he wanted before and there are three [indistinct 00:01:19]. And there are two fellas [indistinct 00:01:25] out there, maybe live with [indistinct 00:01:28] two. Well, he went that [indistinct 00:01:31] that was three. [indistinct 00:01:33] me.	0:57
Bill Spivey	And so, there was four or three pairs of [indistinct 00:01:41] in old James City. That was actually too much. From one, wide awake [indistinct 00:01:48] comes makes me nobody [indistinct 00:01:50] talk to. And also, I'm the last one in that old James City. And brother [indistinct 00:01:59] really. We'll do last one [indistinct 00:02:03].	0:57
Grace	Were you thinking there's somewhat near the [indistinct 00:02:14].	0:57
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:02:15] I was near at the [indistinct 00:02:16] and almost [indistinct 00:02:19]. Got to head before [indistinct 00:02:21] phone, so it's been really. [indistinct 00:02:41] get cut. Before I got [indistinct 00:02:41].	2:20
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, yeah. You can [indistinct 00:02:41].	2:41
Grace	You don't know any [indistinct 00:02:41]?	2:41
Dorothy Spivey	No.	2:41
Grace	[indistinct 00:02:42]. Yeah.	2:41
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:02:42] that safety, but we move out [indistinct 00:02:45] used to get and how we get it. All [indistinct 00:02:51] four. And we got three left, we got two pairs [indistinct 00:03:00].	2:42
Dorothy Spivey	He say he lived in that area. I didn't, but my mother, our foster parents, were members of reform shallow. And they were doing [indistinct 00:03:20] area. That was before then but then after I was born, and a while after, my mother continue her membership there but mom says, it was so far for us to walk within [indistinct 00:03:41] no physical.	3:10
Dorothy Spivey	So far, to walk, she says, children chapel. That's what I'm seeing why we move there are the membership. I was a little girl, because they're still sense through that [indistinct 00:03:58] when I was a child. My mother stayed there after she was married until we were born, allowed to stay and then she decided for convenience, she joined children chapel because it's a missionary Baptist that teach about faith.	3:43
Dorothy Spivey	And that's when they joined then mom say, it was too full for place like missionary Baptist Church, so that's why it was no, nothing malicious, no malice or evil will on why we move but I don't think the late Mr. [indistinct 00:04:38] White, oh too much of [indistinct 00:04:40].	4:18
Grace	Okay. All right. All right. All right.	4:39
Dorothy Spivey	Because I heard Evelyn said one time, "If it burned down that was the whole [indistinct 00:04:49]." So, if that church is burned until they could get another one they hold service over the ashes.	4:43
Grace	[indistinct 00:04:57]. So, I know it was hard for you to accept that [indistinct 00:05:00].	4:58
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. Yeah. That's why.	4:59
Grace	So, it was one of the last churches that come over in this area before the [indistinct 00:05:07]?	4:59
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't there. Mount Charlotte was the head of reform. I attended—That Miss Rebecca Davis, she's a retired teacher. I was a little girl, I attended her wedding [indistinct 00:05:23] Church at that time. Well, I was a little girl, don't ask me year, but I was a little girl and I'm seven or eight.	5:13
Grace	All right. All right.	5:31
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. I attended that wedding.	5:32
Grace	Oh, that's beautiful.	5:44
Dorothy Spivey	Miss Rebecca's wedding.	5:47
Grace	Yes. We're [indistinct 00:05:50]. Okay.	5:49
Dorothy Spivey	You did. Well, I was just thinking, I remember that when I was a little girl, oh, the [indistinct 00:05:50] I was 10, the same school. Although, Bill, lived close by there, but a [indistinct 00:05:55] that I used to pull at my braids or kick at my legs [indistinct 00:06:00].	5:49
Grace	They've always been [indistinct 00:06:02].	6:00
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, yeah. Yeah. Way back. Yeah. But he lived. He lived closer there.	6:03
Bill Spivey	The teacher [indistinct 00:06:07] reform and children chapel, it all come with [indistinct 00:06:07]. I know him by a [indistinct 00:06:07]. And I know when reform [indistinct 00:06:07]. Joining chapel it removed his own [indistinct 00:06:07] thing. 1950. Well, that's the same year I was born but I do know about British [indistinct 00:06:36] because the old villain, were just right down their own foundation where I played around it. And know about [indistinct 00:06:44] from situation I know. My [indistinct 00:06:49] that at the end of the old bridge [indistinct 00:06:53].	6:07
Dorothy Spivey	That's right. I remember that.	6:38
Bill Spivey	This highway going in. The [indistinct 00:06:59] shop was sitting back over down the hill near Turner Mill because I don't...	6:59
Grace	Because that's what [indistinct 00:07:06].	7:03
Bill Spivey	That's with me. He was told me but it was all—	7:06
Grace	Foundation.	7:09
Bill Spivey	—foundation, like that, but do the [indistinct 00:07:12] something like that we join chapel. I join chapel [indistinct 00:07:15]. They all appear in [indistinct 00:07:18] those three.	7:09
Dorothy Spivey	It was [indistinct 00:07:24] as I told that wedding, Mr. [indistinct 00:07:27].	7:25
Grace	Do you think that's [indistinct 00:07:28]?	7:26
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. [indistinct 00:07:28]. I was a little girl, then. Don't ask me the year but anyway, [indistinct 00:07:33]—Am I right, Bill?	7:29
Bill Spivey	What?	7:35
Dorothy Spivey	That church was not too far. I have an idea how [indistinct 00:07:40] near that bridge and Mr Solomon Phillips had a store across the highway, from the church.	7:35
Bill Spivey	Back from the church. Back from the church. [indistinct 00:07:50].	7:48
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:07:50] around before your time [indistinct 00:07:52]. Yeah, because I'm just 10 months older than Bill.	7:50
Grace	Okay. Okay. And what they're speaking about is the old James City which is old, now when we have that brick that they're doing a little development, that's the area that was full-blown just like—In fact, it was more people over in that section look like [indistinct 00:08:13].	7:57
Dorothy Spivey	That's right. And we were children. [indistinct 00:08:16] Amos Williams, to be frankly, I used to think Mr. Amos Williams and Mr. Rod Davis. I thought they were rich because they have a store. And I'm sure at that time, they were in a better condition. It was better with them than us. My daddy, he was a—	8:13
Grace	[indistinct 00:08:40]?	8:31
Dorothy Spivey	No. He was a—You're talking about the late Richardson.	8:43
Grace	Richardson.	8:45
Dorothy Spivey	He was a postmaster at the post office, some time back, but my dad was [indistinct 00:08:52]. Yeah. My dad he was [indistinct 00:08:56]. Yeah. Well, awesome good old days in then. Bill, people would stay down—Sometimes, we stay down at James City. People that live maybe over in this area, stand until that last train, they come in for- —When we go down in the morning, next time, it would come up in the evening and then—Oh, that was a big deal for us, stick around and see who's going to get off or maybe who will then become [indistinct 00:09:22].	8:46
Grace	I heard that they would take excursion or it was [indistinct 00:09:25] Morgan City.	9:22
Dorothy Spivey	Yes.	9:26
Grace	And my mom said that was the big deal to stand out and wait to see you [indistinct 00:09:30].	9:27
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, yeah. But there's an area on [indistinct 00:09:34] sometimes we stayed out there until it got dark.	9:36
Bill Spivey	There are some [indistinct 00:09:39] running. A little [indistinct 00:09:39] wagon or [indistinct 00:09:40].	9:38
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. That's right.	9:38
Grace	So, you did more travel then than you do now? [indistinct 00:09:46] in the area?	9:46
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:09:49] area there was excursion [indistinct 00:09:50]. There was [indistinct 00:09:50] Wilson, Durham or [indistinct 00:10:09]—	9:49
Dorothy Spivey	We went to Durham [indistinct 00:10:14] and I can feel them [indistinct 00:10:14].	10:13
Bill Spivey	And years ago, it used to be steamboat. And this is too [indistinct 00:10:14]. Philip, was the one that they will take [indistinct 00:10:14]. Get ready. Got up in the middle [indistinct 00:10:14] Philip and whenever the [indistinct 00:10:14] but really, whole afraid I did was [indistinct 00:10:14] dance, so you know. And then, we'd have that there but the crew and they shutter that and take real crew up [indistinct 00:10:14]. That's right.	10:13
Grace	That was in James City?	10:13
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. That was [indistinct 00:10:14].	10:13
Grace	James City really was a blooming town.	10:13
Bill Spivey	That's right. That's right. They take real with excursion about every year, I mean, it does some much about every year, it shut up the fill [indistinct 00:10:52]. Stay all day long, come back and do whatever we want to do, come home back, and get off, and then wait and they came still take a look and going home [indistinct 00:10:59] where he was going? You know what I mean? That's right. Here in summer, we do the excursion or a [indistinct 00:11:16] in Old James City. And as the old ones past, young ones, you know what I mean? Are keeping up that old tradition.	10:14
Dorothy Spivey	That's old fashion.	11:19
Bill Spivey	That's old fashion, but you look at it in time, and then, if you compare, is that [indistinct 00:11:28]. Look, all [indistinct 00:11:30] take now, you're taking now [indistinct 00:11:31]. You don't have time now thinking about [indistinct 00:11:34]. Grew up at [indistinct 00:11:36] but I don't have time [indistinct 00:11:40] doing something, you have just outside what [indistinct 00:11:43] you have.	11:29
Bill Spivey	So, obviously, it's [indistinct 00:11:45] if they ain't going to work they got off all different time, you won't stop by. Never stop by. [indistinct 00:11:50] no, you can—	11:44
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:11:55].	11:52
Bill Spivey	You can't even [indistinct 00:12:16] right now, but that's why he came [indistinct 00:12:16] to be even better. It wouldn't done. It was at the [indistinct 00:12:16] just like I say. It'll take woman. It won't be done or something like that, you going to like [indistinct 00:12:16]. Why do you look [indistinct 00:12:17]?	12:15
Bill Spivey	Yeah. Do whatever we're doing, and one took some good do you [indistinct 00:12:23] part of that was good. Not do that now but the [indistinct 00:12:27]. Yeah. The [indistinct 00:12:28] will do it now, the one with the [indistinct 00:12:30].	12:16
Dorothy Spivey	Yes they do. We'll talk about [indistinct 00:12:32].	12:30
Bill Spivey	The one with the [indistinct 00:12:32] or the [indistinct 00:12:33] and they have [indistinct 00:12:35], but now, I don't [indistinct 00:12:38] the whole [indistinct 00:12:39] but they're not always [indistinct 00:12:40] but all of that to me, it was done. Money was cancer. If you were no money, let me tell you what kind of [indistinct 00:12:59] the other day, if you have no money. But after I do more with that [indistinct 00:12:59]—	12:43
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, yes. We did [indistinct 00:12:59].	12:58
Bill Spivey	Came down for nothing.	12:58
Grace	Yeah. But Bill, most of that work—What kind of work did they do in this area? I understand there mills and factories—	12:58
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:13:19], house, and so many [indistinct 00:13:19].	13:18
Dorothy Spivey	And farmers. Almost everybody has their own garden [indistinct 00:13:19].	13:18
Bill Spivey	Mowing down the [indistinct 00:13:20] and total meal [indistinct 00:13:23]. Receive for life and [indistinct 00:13:31] their conservation now but we never met that guy. Yeah.	13:21
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, doing the time, [indistinct 00:13:34] along was breaking there.	13:33
Bill Spivey	If you're feeling weak, try to [indistinct 00:13:38] week long again and [indistinct 00:13:39] and President com over, take a random [indistinct 00:13:44]. Anyway, seasons [indistinct 00:13:48] but still they have cool year around, in the middle [indistinct 00:13:53] no better than covered [indistinct 00:13:57].	13:35
Grace	How would they bring the logs in for the timber in?	13:58
Bill Spivey	A boat. They pulling on a boat. Yeah. They're [indistinct 00:14:13] Northfield, and here to nearby [indistinct 00:14:13]. If I [indistinct 00:14:13].	14:05
Grace	Like badge?	14:13
Bill Spivey	Yeah. No. [indistinct 00:14:13]. The suits are long. [indistinct 00:14:16] a little boat, keep them straight [indistinct 00:14:19]. That's right.	14:13
Grace	So, what I would see is, in the Western, they just keeping the [indistinct 00:14:27].	14:22
Bill Spivey	And they took a road, but able to take boat too, but it took long from down the road [indistinct 00:14:36]. All through slow creek, rise [indistinct 00:14:39]. The moment we had a train. A little [indistinct 00:14:43] running in woods. We've got some [indistinct 00:14:45] all up with [indistinct 00:14:47] then wrapping [indistinct 00:14:48] rise of creek and its low [indistinct 00:14:51] pulling out of the creek, out of creek or river. That's the way they log the meal.	14:38
Grace	They brought them to James City?	14:58
Bill Spivey	They brought them to James City. [indistinct 00:15:02] to turn wheel. Brought the [indistinct 00:15:05]. A little [indistinct 00:15:07] but it was young. And rule [indistinct 00:15:13] by afternoon but they logged in strictly by a train. Where they cut too many [indistinct 00:15:20] own control. They log the [indistinct 00:15:25] that wasn't new.	15:15
Bill Spivey	So, we had right [indistinct 00:15:27] going all along in the end but it all been depression, come on and all been out. Just went down. You respond [indistinct 00:15:37] too.	15:18
Grace	And then, my mom always saying that a lot of the people in the area had the little garden inside the little [indistinct 00:15:47] and they would share—	15:36
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:15:51] share. That's right. That's right.	15:47
Grace	—and so, what was [indistinct 00:15:54]. And they mostly had [indistinct 00:15:57]—	15:51
Dorothy Spivey	Hogs and chickens, on my daddy.	15:53
Grace	Yeah. A little gardening [indistinct 00:16:00]. And they mostly had little shops back there in the area, isn't it?	16:03
Bill Spivey	Yeah.	16:05
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, yeah. DJ Lewis started it off and with Kent. You remember?	16:06
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:16:12].	16:11
Dorothy Spivey	Across over here?	16:11
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:16:13].	16:11
Dorothy Spivey	That's right. And finally, she had a—What does she do? Build a place full of shop on, attached it to her [indistinct 00:16:24, but as I called she was a [indistinct 00:16:27] the tent. Then she would sell snacks and cooked food and...	16:14
Grace	Honestly, a lot of women would cook and serve for the meal or for the workman and that's how they stall their little shops.	16:40
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:16:50].	16:48
Dorothy Spivey	I must defend that. That's right. We are on the ground now that big two-story house of his. And he have store, as I've told you. Those men, the men that had those store, when I was a child I thought they were rich.	16:51
Grace	They probably would do.	17:06
Dorothy Spivey	And that one [indistinct 00:17:10].	17:06
Grace	I was often wondering they say there were people in that time that own acres and acres of land. And this is going back before your time but you say that—Many of them like, one generation almost from being slavery. And here, these people were able to purchase their land and run a little shops and have their own little garden. So, that was quite interesting.	17:12
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. Mr. [indistinct 00:17:41] on that great big two-story house and I says, I hope I don't think that was the only good deed. My father did. That house caught a fire and I mean, it was blazing and my father, risk his life and then got Mr. [indistinct 00:18:05] mother-in-law, his wife's mother. And she was admitted by [indistinct 00:18:09] even got her down and step somehow and I think, just as he got outside the door—	17:40
Grace	[indistinct 00:18:15].	18:13
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:18:16]. Yeah. He had a sore on his heel from that and it took a long time to heal but it did heal but he didn't say [indistinct 00:18:26]. Well, this very spot.	18:17
Grace	Well, isn't that amazing that we sit here and speak with that—	18:30
Bill Spivey	And that's the [indistinct 00:18:33].	18:33
Grace	Okay. All that was [indistinct 00:18:36]. It's over. Almost 100 years ago. [indistinct 00:18:40].	18:37
Dorothy Spivey	A lot of [indistinct 00:18:42] here.	18:39
Grace	If nothing was here.	18:42
Bill Spivey	It fit in the bell. That's right.	18:43
Dorothy Spivey	But he had a beautiful, nice, two-story on this old [indistinct 00:18:49].	18:43
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:18:49].	18:49
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. About [indistinct 00:18:55].	18:49
Bill Spivey	So, in good [indistinct 00:18:58] since the house went out on this fire. [indistinct 00:19:01].	18:49
Grace	Yeah. It seems like quite a few fires in those towns. So, there was a big creek houses in this area. I remember my mom tell about she lived in the grand [indistinct 00:19:15].	19:04
Dorothy Spivey	I remember him. I remember my father.	19:16
Grace	And it burn [indistinct 00:19:20]. It burns?	19:19
Dorothy Spivey	Mm-hmm. Did anybody mention anything about Austin Brown?	19:25
Grace	That he owned so much money and whole are [indistinct 00:19:31]—	19:27
Dorothy Spivey	Up, up in the area in the Mount Gilead in [indistinct 00:19:33].	19:27
Grace	Well, I remember Mr. Austin. He's definitely [indistinct 00:19:37]—	19:34
Dorothy Spivey	I'm talking about—	19:35
Bill Spivey	His grandfather.	19:35
Dorothy Spivey	—the grandfather.	19:35
Grace	Okay. All right, because I always missing out—	19:35
Dorothy Spivey	And nothing—	19:35
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:19:44] Harry. Harry Dave.	19:35
Dorothy Spivey	Harry. That's right.	19:35
Bill Spivey	Harry will cost [indistinct 00:19:47].	19:35
Dorothy Spivey	I don't remember.	19:35
Bill Spivey	I don't remember [indistinct 00:19:49].	19:35
Dorothy Spivey	That's [indistinct 00:19:50] Harry, but Harry [indistinct 00:19:52].	19:35
Bill Spivey	His hair was white.	19:35
Dorothy Spivey	That's right. Because I don't remember [indistinct 00:19:58].	19:35
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:19:59] back there. The Brown.	20:00
Grace	That's why they named it Brown too?	20:01
Bill Spivey	And I guess, that's why they named it Brown too. With Mr. Austin Brown.	20:02
Dorothy Spivey	This was Graysville.	20:06
Bill Spivey	Yeah. Bu I would [indistinct 00:20:10] Graysville.	20:07
Dorothy Spivey	No. I don't—Oh, somebody might know the [indistinct 00:20:15].	20:12
Grace	I know might as well when they left. The fact is—	20:16
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:20:34]. Even that [indistinct 00:20:34] that shit come down to [indistinct 00:20:34]. And hold on inside of that street because they will give it to [indistinct 00:20:35] another one for him. [indistinct 00:20:38] track and going all down by [indistinct 00:20:41] another one.	20:33
Grace	No. It's amazing, because when I was growing up I remember they used to say we're going to Brown's, or they're going to [indistinct 00:20:52]. That's how I remember, so when they said it's on the map and everything else is, oh, I remember. And I can point it out because [indistinct 00:21:00] we just James City. [indistinct 00:21:03].	20:46
Speaker 3	[indistinct 00:21:11].	21:01
Dorothy Spivey	George White?	21:15
Bill Spivey	No. No. No. I don't know [indistinct 00:21:25].	21:16
Dorothy Spivey	Resident?	21:25
Grace	Resident [indistinct 00:21:28].	21:25
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, James [indistinct 00:21:29].	21:28
Grace	We don't know if they could have been distant relatives [indistinct 00:21:34]. We don't know. Maybe if we keep tracing they [indistinct 00:21:36] because I was thinking the same. George [indistinct 00:21:37].	21:31
Speaker 3	[indistinct 00:21:37].	21:36
Bill Spivey	Could've been some relative will come.	21:36
Grace	Because we do have a lot of White family, and they like—What's his name? [indistinct 00:21:50] White?	21:36
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:21:54] White, without [indistinct 00:21:55] like that?	21:54
Grace	That was like that. Hoping [indistinct 00:22:20].	21:58
Bill Spivey	Yeah. [indistinct 00:22:21]. I think. [indistinct 00:22:23].	22:20
Grace	Are you [indistinct 00:22:23] with money?	22:22
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:22:23] something like that. If we got another boat I'll bring him about a [indistinct 00:22:24]. And really must've been [indistinct 00:22:29] I don't know if [indistinct 00:22:31].	22:22
Dorothy Spivey	He's about 19 too.	22:38
Bill Spivey	What? [indistinct 00:22:40].	22:38
Dorothy Spivey	What did you say? No. You said 18.	22:41
Grace	18.	22:43
Bill Spivey	18, 18 [indistinct 00:22:48].	22:43
Speaker 3	Whichever happen on [indistinct 00:22:52]—	22:43
Bill Spivey	But I know two [indistinct 00:23:04]. One of the name, John Robins. And no [indistinct 00:23:04] name, out of button, but I was [indistinct 00:23:04] knew him directly.	22:43
Dorothy Spivey	Which are [indistinct 00:23:04] husband?	22:43
Bill Spivey	Yeah. He should [indistinct 00:23:04] I know man, John Robins, but he just can't [indistinct 00:23:04].	22:43
Dorothy Spivey	I'm not too sure about my mama's foster. He could've—	23:03
Grace	[indistinct 00:23:37]. Was it—	23:36
Dorothy Spivey	Louis? Oh, Louis.	23:36
Grace	Louis [indistinct 00:23:40].	23:39
Dorothy Spivey	You found something about concerning him? One half of the parents.	23:42
Grace	[indistinct 00:23:47].	23:46
Dorothy Spivey	But now, whether served and I wouldn't say yes, I wouldn't say no.	23:50
Grace	He was [indistinct 00:23:57].	23:56
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. His son [indistinct 00:24:01].	24:01
Grace	[indistinct 00:24:01] was dead. That was something to 1892. So, he was full grown then so he could have been back [indistinct 00:24:10].	24:06
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. Now, he and his wife Florence, you have a picture of them?	24:10
Grace	I have them.	24:14
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, my mother of [indistinct 00:24:19] heard us say. Her mother died at the age of 28. Mommy have to be 87, but her mother died at age of 28. All right. Maybe I've heard her say, but I'm not sure how old she could've been...	24:16
Bill Spivey	But it was, I think, amazing home. I believe it was amazing home. I feel like it's all worth it but long at that time they did [indistinct 00:24:45] used to call them at that time of Juvenile. Sure, you know. Good and [indistinct 00:24:50] Francis. Dudley and Francis, just call [indistinct 00:24:55] area.	24:37
Bill Spivey	And they had children that do it all and when they [indistinct 00:25:02]. The odd [indistinct 00:25:04] would have a parade from that hall to different churches, you know what I mean? Well, at least they had to make appearances out. Make sure [indistinct 00:25:12] but it surely be in [indistinct 00:25:14] too. In [indistinct 00:25:14].	24:57
Dorothy Spivey	Does that mean [indistinct 00:25:22]?	25:14
Bill Spivey	That was a long time ago.	25:21
Grace	So, you had all those organizations and [indistinct 00:25:25]?	25:21
Bill Spivey	Yeah. Yeah. Not to pity.	25:21
Dorothy Spivey	How about the—	25:21
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:25:31] Society?	25:21
Dorothy Spivey	—[indistinct 00:25:31] Society.	25:30
Bill Spivey	We're allowed at churches.	25:32
Dorothy Spivey	Was the organization called the [indistinct 00:25:36]?	25:33
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:25:37]. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Three or four [indistinct 00:25:41]. And all fellas, amazing. [indistinct 00:25:48] not fault. And then the theory, the women of [indistinct 00:25:53] organization get the children [indistinct 00:25:55]. And they call them at that time, to get the juvenile.	25:38
Bill Spivey	In the organization, you have the juvenile [indistinct 00:26:01]. Sure you get [indistinct 00:26:01]. We got a decade on [indistinct 00:26:01] but it was, I mean, we really had it. And there was a hole over there. [indistinct 00:26:16]. That's right.	25:57
Dorothy Spivey	I don't know if I was there but had anyone discussed about the big two-story house that used to be down in James City, with over on the right-hand side—	26:18
Bill Spivey	Because we always [indistinct 00:26:29]—	26:28
Dorothy Spivey	—I mean, a kindergarten.	26:29
Grace	That was a missionary.	26:29
Bill Spivey	That was missionary. Alexander.	26:32
Dorothy Spivey	I meant the kindergarten, they moved from [indistinct 00:26:41].	26:36
Bill Spivey	Right there. Yeah. Right there. [indistinct 00:26:44]. Right there.	26:41
Grace	Do you remember Ms Caroline Alexander, I understand she was a teacher and a missionary here.	26:45
Dorothy Spivey	I give you a picture of her.	26:51
Grace	Yeah. Yeah. You remember that Mrs Caroline, saw it the first [indistinct 00:26:56]?	26:54
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:26:56] Alexander.	26:56
Dorothy Spivey	I remember her but [indistinct 00:26:56]. Yeah.	26:56
Grace	Because we're going to have it all displayed to [indistinct 00:27:04] she did a lot [indistinct 00:27:07] about the lane when she [indistinct 00:27:18]. So, she was wondering if she [indistinct 00:27:19].	26:56
Dorothy Spivey	Because I was sick. Yeah. Then she was sick. I think, she died. The late [indistinct 00:27:23]. Place like [indistinct 00:27:26]. I'll wait for both of them as a little girl. No choices such as I could do. I'm in the garden because when we move, I used to pick beans, vegetables, for Reverend [indistinct 00:27:37] and for his wife. I knew both of them.	27:26
Dorothy Spivey	I used to work with them and this, while she was [indistinct 00:27:45]. I used to do the chores [indistinct 00:27:57] and then, when we sat down [indistinct 00:27:57]. Must have [indistinct 00:27:57] house or sometimes doing that kind of work. Grace [indistinct 00:27:57] I have all this [indistinct 00:27:57].	27:41
Grace	Oh, it's all right. At least, [indistinct 00:27:57].	27:57
Dorothy Spivey	Yes. I knew [indistinct 00:27:57]. And did anyone mentioned about Miss Colby?	27:57
Grace	[indistinct 00:28:11]?	28:08
Dorothy Spivey	Bill, [indistinct 00:28:12] she was missionary?	28:11
Bill Spivey	Mm—hmm. Yeah. She was a [indistinct 00:28:12]. Yeah. I got to go [indistinct 00:28:17].	28:12
Dorothy Spivey	During that time or later, must have [indistinct 00:28:25] because she's [indistinct 00:28:27]. Yeah. And oh, I'm sorry that I have said something about it. Just old memories and some things [indistinct 00:28:40] stick with, and some going [indistinct 00:28:44].	28:22
Grace	Well, Mrs. Alexander, Caroline, down the [indistinct 00:28:47] is in the [indistinct 00:28:49].	28:44
Dorothy Spivey	Yes. I imagine I was about the only one who have [indistinct 00:28:55] my mom—	28:53
Grace	They go excited at [indistinct 00:28:57].	28:56
Dorothy Spivey	My mother kept up.	28:57
Grace	That's beautiful. I just got so excited when you told me that because I read about her and I watch the [indistinct 00:29:07] and that's what even further that. [indistinct 00:29:10] great grandfather. [indistinct 00:29:12]. You remember [indistinct 00:29:13]. You don't [indistinct 00:29:14] you can't be hear anything they said [indistinct 00:29:17] with someone if you can't [indistinct 00:29:19] old people said.	28:59
Bill Spivey	One time, we did have a picture I don't know, I had paid for one time [indistinct 00:29:24] do hot but I've been [indistinct 00:29:26] always. One time, the law want to come [indistinct 00:29:30] and do something and all old men met him, [indistinct 00:29:34] the bridge. That old bridge. They had pickaxe. They had pickaxe showed [indistinct 00:29:39] actually that one at door, the law went back down [indistinct 00:29:43]. And we all come back [indistinct 00:29:44]. And they didn't move, they didn't cross each other line. You know what I mean?	29:21
Grace	Okay.	29:47
Bill Spivey	But I had a picture of it. I don't know what happened to it or who's house [indistinct 00:29:51] but they say, I [indistinct 00:29:55] to say it. And I don't care remember. I wasn't there, "But you see, sudden the law want to come over here and do something, and it wasn't right." It all over [indistinct 00:30:05] with pickaxe. Show [indistinct 00:30:09] bush ashes, throw [indistinct 00:30:11].	29:47
Grace	All the weapons they have?	30:12
Bill Spivey	All the weapon they had. The axe, when you just call a bad man [indistinct 00:30:17]. So, they say they couldn't get [indistinct 00:30:19] so they all went back that way. And didn't come back this way when they know [indistinct 00:30:27] end of the bridge. That's what they say, when they got it together [indistinct 00:30:30] try to—	30:14
Grace	After the mom and I didn't understand which was my grandma and that was watching [indistinct 00:30:38] stories. Use to say, "Well, if you can drink all that, drink that water. You can't swim and you can't drink that water, you've been [indistinct 00:30:46]—"	30:32
Bill Spivey	Better not to decide. [indistinct 00:30:48]. They didn't have too much [indistinct 00:30:51] I mean. And people are more scared [indistinct 00:30:56]. And look at you, [indistinct 00:30:59]. Back away from me. Back away from me if you [indistinct 00:31:01] bad.	30:46
Bill Spivey	And at that time, he'll take more stuff and sometimes, some [indistinct 00:31:08] will not [indistinct 00:31:09] as soon as they see. I heard someone [indistinct 00:31:11] some of the old doctors, where they come right on and [indistinct 00:31:16] drove Harrisburg. They tell me to wash my horse, I didn't wash the horse [indistinct 00:31:19] right now, don't [indistinct 00:31:20] but that was [indistinct 00:31:22].	31:03
Bill Spivey	And dog going back to see some of the old dogs come out [indistinct 00:31:25]. You know what I mean? But it was—Well, I tell you [indistinct 00:31:35] for government. [indistinct 00:31:37]. It was done [indistinct 00:31:38] it is now, because long and then it was all disabled over time [indistinct 00:31:45] but there is more respect. Give them more respect. People say good morning, good evening, there's a [indistinct 00:31:54] like this, you wave ahead out of somebody there, but now these young women walk right through your yard and take a bucket of [indistinct 00:32:00] and don't say nothing.	31:22
Bill Spivey	Do the law back [indistinct 00:32:03]? But law [indistinct 00:32:05] and had to go to law and done maybe [indistinct 00:32:11] or I got a pizza [indistinct 00:32:12]. Sure, you can take mine [indistinct 00:32:14] put a strap on, that was it.	32:01
Grace	Doing a little [indistinct 00:32:15] in there, huh?	32:14
Bill Spivey	You will [indistinct 00:32:15] stay them out and that was it, or you could stay them out just [indistinct 00:32:21]. You're a parent, you got a child, seven years old, you stay them out. No, I want to [indistinct 00:32:28] right up. You hit me in my [indistinct 00:32:29]. See?	32:15
Grace	Unless your taking kids [indistinct 00:32:32]—	32:29
Bill Spivey	You're taking care of them so you're not [indistinct 00:32:34] just make them worst. Now, in the world [indistinct 00:32:37]. You'll be seven, eight years old this coming June, I never been in jail in my life. Not as old as [indistinct 00:32:45]. Come here and just kill anybody in here and [indistinct 00:32:49].	32:35
Grace	Because you feel it like...	32:49
Bill Spivey	You feel like the law [indistinct 00:32:52]. I got to go to jail and take my own eyes so it was better alone here. The law was actually the law. Actually, like I said, if a child do something bad, going to your grandfather or breaking around the [indistinct 00:33:09].	32:50
Bill Spivey	That time, your parents would get together with you all, what I have [indistinct 00:33:14]. And then, when he get child, he was just as hockey, that box he said, "[indistinct 00:33:19], no." So, he can't [indistinct 00:33:21]. No. I'm just telling [indistinct 00:33:23] speak.	33:10
Grace	It is the truth.	33:23
Bill Spivey	It's true. They come up right quick and if it went to the law. The law here they have [indistinct 00:33:30]. Then sheriff tell him, "No. Put a strap and come out in the backyard." Put it on. I know, one time. Freddy. You know, Freddy? You know what I had? Freddy mother.	33:27
Grace	I didn't know [indistinct 00:33:39].	33:38
Bill Spivey	You know, Freddy? Well, Freddy did something bad and some way got to the law. And surely, we don't have any [indistinct 00:33:50] get him and do this [indistinct 00:33:57] kidding me [indistinct 00:33:58]. My friend again, do that to mom and you know what [indistinct 00:34:01]?	33:38
Grace	Are you sure that he stopped?	33:48
Bill Spivey	Sure. He [indistinct 00:34:02] stop. No. The [indistinct 00:34:04].	33:48
Grace	It's abuse. Yeah.	34:07
Bill Spivey	Yeah. Abuse. So, I don't—	34:08
Grace	The children know the [indistinct 00:34:11].	34:08
Bill Spivey	Yeah. And the [indistinct 00:34:13]. That's right. If there's law again, I mean, there's more respect.	34:11
Grace	Yeah. And I understand that the parent, if the child did something, a neighbor could help discipline that child. And the child will be afraid to tell the parents so they didn't know.	34:21
Bill Spivey	Yeah. They didn't know. Yeah.	34:32
Dorothy Spivey	There were better children [indistinct 00:34:33].	34:32
Bill Spivey	There's a better children, and if you don't want to do it, so I'm wrong. Yeah. There should be someone stop them and go home [indistinct 00:34:40]. All right. Tell me that, I'll go. I am gone. I will be hot for you unless you tell her mom I'll be hot with her too, but no, you tell a child, if you see a [indistinct 00:34:50] really—if you see a child [indistinct 00:34:54] with matches and a kind of kerosene, I guess, going to see his parents house on fire. Your best bet, you will get another can and get some oil and tell [indistinct 00:35:06].	34:34
Grace	They help him out.	35:05
Bill Spivey	They help him out, because if you tell his parents, that wasn't my job. If you say too much to that little child, the law won't get you. So, if you get him out [indistinct 00:35:19] house on fire, she doesn't know [indistinct 00:35:21]. That's the truth. We should have start [indistinct 00:35:24] caring about [indistinct 00:35:24]. You tell when I was going to your car for holiday, and he will tell the law. I got to go jail.	35:08
Grace	Yeah. The law was just that against [indistinct 00:35:34].	35:32
Bill Spivey	Yeah. The law was [indistinct 00:35:34]. You ain't got to let him do [indistinct 00:35:36] lady's car. Trying to keep him out of trouble. Then, he will do something [indistinct 00:35:41].	35:33
Grace	A bit back to this, during that time of silver one, I know you don't remember but anything else you could recall way back within the old people might have said that we could [indistinct 00:36:01] before we [indistinct 00:36:33].	35:41
Speaker 3	[indistinct 00:36:33].	36:33
Bill Spivey	Well, I think, I heard [indistinct 00:36:35] with my job when I was a Button Boy. So, about a time that beyond [indistinct 00:36:41] leading to. Oh, yeah. Leading to [indistinct 00:36:44] she'll be back to the ground floor like that and a lot of [indistinct 00:36:49] in there. I mean, doing the world [indistinct 00:36:53] be cool and back to the [indistinct 00:36:54] and sometimes, I think, you have far, I was In the front when he going back.	36:33
Bill Spivey	And sometimes, it brings up a little [indistinct 00:37:04] be sure that one [indistinct 00:37:05] I think, I would've messed up Roberts [indistinct 00:37:07] and they have to look out to the front area and they were all babysitters, they want to do but they started to turn around and getting girls [indistinct 00:37:15].	37:03
Bill Spivey	Well, I think, I heard [indistinct 00:37:17] Roberts, see that and see about to the food and bed. And that's with the water and [indistinct 00:37:23] but food, it could get [indistinct 00:37:25] water if you know what I mean?Getting like that and they told my whole life, a lot that I forgot but I'll be a little [indistinct 00:37:33] about the [indistinct 00:37:35].	37:14
Grace	Trying to keep [indistinct 00:37:35].	37:34
Bill Spivey	Trying to keep [indistinct 00:37:40] too. If you don't [indistinct 00:37:40] warmer too.	37:35
Speaker 3	[indistinct 00:37:44].	37:39
Bill Spivey	Hmm?	37:39
Speaker 3	[indistinct 00:37:45].	37:39
Bill Spivey	No. They told so much on me, I can't give the whole history of it but I would [indistinct 00:37:52] anybody answers and [indistinct 00:37:55] but I mean, he told me a quite real.	37:48
Grace	Most of them felt that [indistinct 00:38:02]. It was build more and they [indistinct 00:38:06].	38:00
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. They want to be a part of it.	38:06
Speaker 3	[indistinct 00:38:16].	38:15
Bill Spivey	No. I can't remember just what [indistinct 00:38:16] there what's best, but I know they didn't say about, or give name about—[indistinct 00:38:20]. A lot of people following, that's really to see [indistinct 00:38:20] of James City, and I think, the commanding of [indistinct 00:38:42] named James. He did tell me James something.	38:20
Grace	[indistinct 00:38:45].	38:44
Bill Spivey	That's who receive and it was all over, he say he laid it out, just give it to us and [indistinct 00:38:52] named James something. That's where the [indistinct 00:38:54] the James City, I heard until [indistinct 00:38:56] but you didn't see, he may [indistinct 00:38:58] whatt I'll figure again but long time [indistinct 00:39:02]. And you see, that man, this James, he laid it out and [indistinct 00:39:07] Mr. James said, "This is your little [indistinct 00:39:10]."	38:46
Grace	So, just [indistinct 00:39:15] given to them as a recreation [indistinct 00:39:18]. Finding them [indistinct 00:39:18] and many of you said, this is why [indistinct 00:39:30] or grandma. She said, she died there and she almost [indistinct 00:39:32] he had to leave them and pick her up before the [indistinct 00:39:35] she was too old for that [indistinct 00:39:36].	39:09
Bill Spivey	That fella were [indistinct 00:39:37] said. That's right. [indistinct 00:39:39].	39:35
Grace	And she would said [indistinct 00:39:41] after she left it, when they bought in this area.	39:35
Bill Spivey	But most of the old ones grannies, they didn't pass there. Most of the old one actually didn't pass there. All over that. Do you know pass over there?	39:45
Grace	[indistinct 00:39:55].	39:54
Bill Spivey	Yeah. And all over that I know, but a few, passed over there. [indistinct 00:40:03] she passed on their side but I'm like you, I don't think she would never sacrifice. Didn't know. No one knows [indistinct 00:40:09].	39:54
Grace	And it still leads, when you come and I go through their, I feel some [indistinct 00:40:18].	40:16
Bill Spivey	But there's a feeling.	40:16
Grace	There's a feeling that you belong.	40:20
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. There's a feeling. Yeah. There's a feeling. No, I've been to [indistinct 00:40:25] repair. I looks that way when I [indistinct 00:40:28] every time I [indistinct 00:40:29] I look that way and I just [indistinct 00:40:32] spot, replace it, and bring each one of those [indistinct 00:40:39] so she got it all done but I can walk through there and just by [indistinct 00:40:43] on the spot, but maybe not foot for foot but about [indistinct 00:40:48] there.	40:21
Grace	My mother talks about them. That she can vision the whole area where everybody lives. And see, I have a list of what she's telling me [indistinct 00:41:00] from the water back and from what my [indistinct 00:41:03] if I remember [indistinct 00:41:05] grandmother and then you will go. She try to show me [indistinct 00:41:08].	40:49
Bill Spivey	Talk about, how I walk through like a [indistinct 00:41:11] spotted. Maybe not. I've been direct on [indistinct 00:41:15] put my clothes to it, you don't hear about [indistinct 00:41:17].	41:09
Grace	I'll just stand on post office [indistinct 00:41:21] the room. [indistinct 00:41:24].	41:20
Bill Spivey	You got me a [indistinct 00:41:26] question that I remember—	41:25
Grace	[indistinct 00:41:28].	41:26
Bill Spivey	—of what [indistinct 00:41:29]. He was putting [indistinct 00:41:30] and ridges all year.	41:28
Dorothy Spivey	Well, that was [indistinct 00:41:40] that needs to [indistinct 00:41:40].	41:40
Bill Spivey	So, I don't mean [indistinct 00:41:40]. You have me feel how was [indistinct 00:41:44] wife.	41:40
Dorothy Spivey	That's [indistinct 00:41:47].	41:40
Bill Spivey	Yeah. Do you remember? Anika granddad and [indistinct 00:41:56] grandmother?	41:51
Dorothy Spivey	It was who?	41:56
Bill Spivey	Anika's granddad. And that was grandma Julie's mother.	41:58
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, no. No. No. Grandma Julie but not her mother.	42:00
Bill Spivey	Well, her mother is having [indistinct 00:42:12] you never miss a friend of Joel?	42:11
Dorothy Spivey	Friends of Joel?	42:11
Bill Spivey	Fenny.	42:11
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:42:12].	42:11
Bill Spivey	Okay. Joel, [indistinct 00:42:13]-	42:11
Dorothy Spivey	Probably she [indistinct 00:42:13].	42:11
Bill Spivey	She would not [indistinct 00:42:17] she was kid married in [indistinct 00:42:19]. And she was kids [indistinct 00:42:22]. Now, if you remember this mini clan? Do you remember [indistinct 00:42:27] grandmother?	42:16
Grace	It was Amy—Oh, Clara?	42:24
Bill Spivey	Clara will know and his mother and Chris [indistinct 00:42:27] mother. I told [indistinct 00:42:27]. Martila, I think. Go back at [indistinct 00:42:27] dealing it.	42:24
Grace	You back again with these people [indistinct 00:42:27] slaves of [indistinct 00:42:27].	42:24
Bill Spivey	Do you remember [indistinct 00:42:56] alone? You had to go on the route [indistinct 00:42:59] by that, the big house, "Oh, what are you all standing out there?"	42:27
Dorothy Spivey	Because again, you leave.	43:00
Bill Spivey	I leave that day. Yeah. I leave that day. Yeah. I leave that day.	43:00
Grace	See, that's what happen [indistinct 00:43:10] a lot of people, young will compare 70 some years, but they moved over [indistinct 00:43:17] this town, this portion of James City is over 100 years this year. They were told to get out of there, 1892. [indistinct 00:43:19]	43:09
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:43:19].	43:18
Grace	It's like, come on. She's like, she never with you but traveling around with grand and with daddy, and her mother. She remembered old James City but [indistinct 00:43:39]—	43:18
Bill Spivey	Okay, [indistinct 00:43:40]. Right here, there's this amazing hole is. They didn't know [indistinct 00:43:44] don't you?	43:42
Grace	[indistinct 00:43:44].	43:43
Bill Spivey	Or [indistinct 00:43:46] harder. You're taking [indistinct 00:43:48] houses who live there.	43:43
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. And that was [indistinct 00:43:51] his son.	43:49
Bill Spivey	His daughter?	43:52
Dorothy Spivey	The daughter.	43:52
Bill Spivey	Who does she marry? Now, talking to your town now.	43:55
Grace	Since you came from [indistinct 00:44:00].	43:59
Bill Spivey	You came over my town and I'll tell you about your town.	44:00
Dorothy Spivey	I don't know [indistinct 00:44:04].	44:03
Bill Spivey	I don't know [indistinct 00:44:04], but who does she marry?	44:03
Dorothy Spivey	I don't know.	44:07
Bill Spivey	Frank [indistinct 00:44:09]. Jenny's brother.	44:07
Dorothy Spivey	That's right. That's right. She tells me [indistinct 00:44:12].	44:12
Bill Spivey	I won't know. I'm in your town, though.	44:12
Dorothy Spivey	Yes. I remember [indistinct 00:44:17].	44:13
Grace	Well, you got it from [indistinct 00:44:21]. If you got whole [indistinct 00:44:22].	44:20
Bill Spivey	I got it over a few hours. If you don't know how to boil a ramen around. And when grandma saw me [indistinct 00:44:31] in front of it.	44:21
Dorothy Spivey	They didn't [indistinct 00:44:33].	44:31
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:44:33].	44:31
Grace	I've heard about some [indistinct 00:44:36].	44:31
Dorothy Spivey	He's sticks [indistinct 00:44:37]. How [indistinct 00:44:38] 50 cents a week. 10 cents [indistinct 00:44:41] but I still do.	44:38
Grace	That's [indistinct 00:44:48].	44:48
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:44:48]. I can [indistinct 00:44:48] and that was a good money and all men, John, Lee, was the transferrer of people who do laundry at home. I have them, year back. And he died [indistinct 00:45:00] both trips for [indistinct 00:45:04]—	44:48
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:45:04] 15 cents?	45:04
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:45:06].	45:04
Grace	He was taking the clothes back [indistinct 00:45:08].	45:06
Bill Spivey	Back to pick up and then deliver.	45:07
Grace	Bring it over here.	45:08
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:45:13] they care of that. And those islands of business names. She could [indistinct 00:45:18] like I mentioned about [indistinct 00:45:20].	45:08
Grace	It's amazing how the people always have the way of working for themselves.	45:22
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. They did [indistinct 00:45:31].	45:30
Grace	They were entrepreneurs.	45:30
Bill Spivey	They wait for the [indistinct 00:45:31] make it [indistinct 00:45:34]. That's right. Then do whole [indistinct 00:45:36]. Can take a whole [indistinct 00:45:38] I don't care how [indistinct 00:45:39]. All across the [indistinct 00:45:41] but I don't bring it home, all the [indistinct 00:45:44] and it gets around [indistinct 00:45:45] baseball.	45:30
Grace	Take two. It was like a [indistinct 00:45:48]—	45:45
Bill Spivey	That's right. And balance it. They didn't take [indistinct 00:45:51] with the clothes when I'm pushing [indistinct 00:45:52] like that, said it only [indistinct 00:45:54] with it.	45:49
Grace	Enhance for it.	45:50
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:45:58] something else. You just be—You know what I mean? Yeah. Hands full of [indistinct 00:46:02] and that's very close. [indistinct 00:46:03] included, and walk. And it wouldn't fall off.	45:50
Grace	We have [indistinct 00:46:08] though.	45:50
Bill Spivey	How did they do that? how they did it? I don't know. Press that [indistinct 00:46:13]—	45:50

Bill Spivey	It will be too slow or too fresh and make it touch on the best to beat [indistinct 00:00:09] in your life.	0:05
Dorothy Spivey	Pie.	0:09
Bill Spivey	And I know [indistinct 00:00:14] she did a lot—she have been dead a long, long time. Grace, [indistinct 00:00:17] will talk [indistinct 00:00:18] about the [indistinct 00:00:19]?	0:14
Dorothy Spivey	Okay.	0:18
Grace	My favorite moment.	0:18
Dorothy Spivey	This a lot of [indistinct 00:00:21].	0:18
Bill Spivey	We will talk—She never did learn how to cook on a cook stove.	0:21
Grace	Okay.	0:26
Bill Spivey	She cook in a fireplace.	0:26
Dorothy Spivey	Fireplace.	0:27
Grace	Mm-hmm.	0:27
Bill Spivey	She can cook just [indistinct 00:00:29] pancakes on a fireplace and you can cook in any oven. She oven [indistinct 00:00:36].	0:28
Grace	And then, how does she—Did you cook?	0:35
Bill Spivey	But she shared. A fireplace [indistinct 00:00:40], but she had on. You just think. She had on in all [indistinct 00:00:47] figure out. In a pothead [indistinct 00:00:50] all the way. Could you put it all [indistinct 00:00:53]? She [indistinct 00:00:55] fire like that. And I will [indistinct 00:00:58] damage given the [indistinct 00:00:59]. Pull it out and check [indistinct 00:01:03] to cook [indistinct 00:01:06] and pancake, scale it. But the thing, had leaves on it. About like that. Three leaves, like that. Put [indistinct 00:01:16] on it and had all [indistinct 00:01:18] with a whole millions of dollars.	0:35
Grace	Everything was [indistinct 00:01:21]?	1:14
Bill Spivey	And everything was on.	1:14
Grace	Okay. Yeah.	1:14
Bill Spivey	And then it take cold and put on top of it.	1:23
Grace	Yes. [indistinct 00:01:27].	1:26
Bill Spivey	So, the heat will gone because [indistinct 00:01:28].	1:26
Grace	Yeah.	1:27
Bill Spivey	You put leaves [indistinct 00:01:29] you got a [indistinct 00:01:31] top and bottom, but the heat was gone from top to bottom. And cooks in [indistinct 00:01:35] I was eaten [indistinct 00:01:35] and cold [indistinct 00:01:35] talking about. That's too big. Lord help us.	1:32
Grace	Graceful [indistinct 00:01:35].	1:35
Bill Spivey	Graceful.	1:35
Grace	Okay.	1:35
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:01:36] didn't cook [indistinct 00:01:44]. Nice cooking, what would I say? Can you—	1:36
Grace	Yeah. Yeah. Very good.	1:48
Dorothy Spivey	Definitely.	1:48
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:01:49] that was [indistinct 00:01:50].	1:48
Grace	Take into the pain.	1:48
Bill Spivey	Again, pressure cooker and all that stuff, pressure cooker is good to cook. You cook white bean in 10 minutes, they will kill you.	1:51
Grace	Okay.	1:56
Bill Spivey	No, that—	1:58
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, the pressure cooker is—I don't know.	1:58
Grace	They cook—	1:58
Bill Spivey	During that time, they had cooked beans, so you'll have beans whatever could beans and stuff like that.	2:02
Grace	Yeah.	2:08
Bill Spivey	You put them on right out the breakfast. Well, during that time, 8:00 was around breakfast time.	2:08
Grace	Okay.	2:14
Bill Spivey	You put on them beans then and they roll. That [indistinct 00:02:19] bean will joke from, I would say, 8:00 to 9:00, tell about food not even [indistinct 00:02:25] and honey, you could eat them some [indistinct 00:02:27] bean and it wouldn't let you. Now, you [indistinct 00:02:30]. You appear more [indistinct 00:02:31]. You appear in your [indistinct 00:02:33].	2:15
Grace	They cook it so fast.	2:27
Bill Spivey	Wasn't cook too fast.	2:27
Grace	Yeah. Yeah.	2:27
Bill Spivey	Cook too fast.	2:27
Grace	Yeah.	2:27
Bill Spivey	So fast.	2:27
Grace	It can help you [indistinct 00:02:39].	2:27
Bill Spivey	And they did is just all that stuff and then just will cook too fast [indistinct 00:02:44] and then roll the beans, baby. Can be just a good, and sweet, and just a soft, and [indistinct 00:02:51] can eat them, but no. Even the pressure cooker. And good is, [indistinct 00:02:56] cook within eight minutes.	2:41
Grace	Yeah. Okay.	2:57
Bill Spivey	You can [indistinct 00:02:58] cook.	2:57
Grace	I never heard bean, but they really do. And if you cook them long, they are no good.	2:58
Bill Spivey	They are no good, on a pressure cooker. But you put them on pot, they will [indistinct 00:03:05] something. Not to cook it in 10. You don't know what to eat? Ham, you can smell ham who's [indistinct 00:03:14] on it. Now, you will [indistinct 00:03:16] frying pan. You lose ham.	3:02
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, God. No.	3:18
Bill Spivey	But you don't know what is [indistinct 00:03:28]. It's a true. [indistinct 00:03:28] lie. That's right. So, [indistinct 00:03:28] you can [indistinct 00:03:29].	3:27
Dorothy Spivey	I was so bad at [indistinct 00:03:29].	3:29
Bill Spivey	All the people at house and they'll be cooking breakfast.	3:29
Grace	Oh, yeah.	3:30
Bill Spivey	You could smell that ham.	3:32
Grace	Mm-hmm.	3:33
Bill Spivey	You could smell that ham, you could smell the coffee.	3:34
Grace	Mm-hmm.	3:37
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:03:37] you've been a [indistinct 00:03:39] coffee.	3:37
Grace	You smell that.	3:41
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:03:42] you would run away. You could [indistinct 00:03:42] you got it [indistinct 00:03:43] enough. That's the truth. That's the truth. Grace, that's the truth. You could actually smell that ham, baby.	3:41
Grace	Oh, yeah. I just think you [indistinct 00:03:51] I wouldn't [indistinct 00:03:54] which is [indistinct 00:03:56] I can smell food.	3:50
Bill Spivey	That's okay. Well, can you smell it now?	3:56
Grace	Okay.	3:56
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah.	3:56
Grace	We don't smell [indistinct 00:03:58].	3:56
Bill Spivey	It may [indistinct 00:03:59] burning, you smell it burning, but what it is? You want to know what it is. That's the truth.	3:56
Grace	Yeah. And we're looking the pot.	3:56
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:04:07] the pot.	3:56
Grace	What you think?	3:56
Bill Spivey	You look in to pot, you don't know what is going. [indistinct 00:04:10] he's got a name on label, but you don't know the taste, don't know taste there. [indistinct 00:04:14]. And they're smoke at me.	4:10
Grace	Yeah.	4:13
Bill Spivey	They smoke at me.	4:13
Grace	Yeah.	4:13
Bill Spivey	They [indistinct 00:04:20] how to smoke—	4:13
Dorothy Spivey	About the smoke here?	4:13
Bill Spivey	Right. All up in there and everything. They have some like a little [indistinct 00:04:25] pot or [indistinct 00:04:26] and then make a fire when it smoke [indistinct 00:04:28] a oak.	4:13
Dorothy Spivey	Okay.	4:13
Bill Spivey	And then build a fire and then the smoke, that thing, there's a smoke. And you see smoke on everywhere [indistinct 00:04:37] about ham. And that ham will last—[indistinct 00:04:41] in that smokehouse [indistinct 00:04:44]. They want to [indistinct 00:04:46], they go cut it all. [indistinct 00:04:48] little bit and [indistinct 00:04:50] go.	4:32
Grace	So, you really didn't have to buy very much on the store?	4:50
Bill Spivey	No. No. No. [indistinct 00:04:55] your own. Chicken, [indistinct 00:04:56] everybody had chicken. And you'll want a chicken and [indistinct 00:04:59] chicken. We got a chicken in pan.	4:54
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, yeah.	5:02
Grace	Oh.	5:06
Bill Spivey	Or cook. Well, they [indistinct 00:05:09] out four or five up [indistinct 00:05:11] keep them up there with all [indistinct 00:05:12].	5:06
Dorothy Spivey	They come and say, "[indistinct 00:05:12] cleanse and [indistinct 00:05:12] on that."	5:11
Bill Spivey	You fell [indistinct 00:05:12].	5:11
Grace	Cleanse and then—	5:11
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. Cleanse them out. That's right.	5:11
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. Put them up for certain—	5:11
Bill Spivey	And you will say, "Go and get it."	5:13
Dorothy Spivey	—[indistinct 00:05:19] that is.	5:18
Bill Spivey	You want a chicken, then go get it.	5:19
Grace	Mm-hmm.	5:20
Bill Spivey	But now, you can cook the chicken on, how to cook chicken on, but there is blood to the bone. That's true. You fry and fry. It'd be so hard, you can't eat it. Still right, you have the bone blood. Mm, that's the truth. Great? No. It sounds funny—	5:22
Grace	[indistinct 00:05:38].	5:37
Bill Spivey	—but, baby, it's the truth.	5:38
Grace	It is the truth.	5:39
Bill Spivey	It's the truth. That's right.	5:39
Grace	That is the whole true. Really is.	5:39
Bill Spivey	Yeah, it's the truth.	5:39
Grace	And you're telling the truth—	5:39
Bill Spivey	That's right.	5:39
Grace	—that's why I laugh of it.	5:39
Bill Spivey	I don't know. And like I said, there are recipe and they seen that it had to come up from a hobo.	5:54
Grace	A hobo.	5:57
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:05:59] everything you cook, you got a recipe. And now, everything you cook is cholesterol.	6:00
Grace	Yeah.	6:05
Bill Spivey	Everything you cook now is cholesterol. You can't eat this, cholesterol.	6:08
Dorothy Spivey	You [indistinct 00:06:12] to watch the cholesterol.	6:11
Bill Spivey	You can't eat that, cholesterol. It's chemical.	6:11
Grace	That's right [indistinct 00:06:15].	6:14
Bill Spivey	And during that time, the [indistinct 00:06:19] they get the [indistinct 00:06:20] out of the hole and then tried up and you [indistinct 00:06:23]. And, honey, they could anything [indistinct 00:06:27] out of that [indistinct 00:06:28], they call it the cracklings. They take that crackling and make it up and [indistinct 00:06:33]. You can get a [indistinct 00:06:33] of crackling break and a sweet potato and you could [indistinct 00:06:39] drink water. And [indistinct 00:06:43]. That's the truth. That's the truth.	6:15
Grace	Yeah, [indistinct 00:06:45].	6:45
Bill Spivey	That's the truth.	6:45
Grace	Okay.	6:45
Bill Spivey	And they tried that load up and then strain it. They have [indistinct 00:06:53] to strain it. They strain it [indistinct 00:06:56]. And then they put it in the [indistinct 00:06:57]. Now, that was pure oil.	6:50
Dorothy Spivey	They put bayleaves.	7:01
Bill Spivey	They put bayleaves and a seasoning like that, the bayleaves. But that was pure oil. Now, if you get [indistinct 00:07:09], cholesterol.	7:01
Dorothy Spivey	Cholesterol.	7:03
Bill Spivey	If you get [indistinct 00:07:13], cholesterol. If you get shrimp, cholesterol. Everything you get now, cholesterol. That's right.	7:14
Dorothy Spivey	That's what [indistinct 00:07:23].	7:22
Bill Spivey	You [indistinct 00:07:24] there. Really. Everything you eat now, you can't do too much of this. [indistinct 00:07:30] anybody tell me five [indistinct 00:07:32] and that's enough. Yeah, right. The [indistinct 00:07:39]. True. It's true. They will had a [indistinct 00:07:42] and sometime had a [indistinct 00:07:42], you left [indistinct 00:07:42] five. I don't want to know. Huh? True.	7:22
Dorothy Spivey	They trying to look out for you.	7:42
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:07:42] why?	7:42
Dorothy Spivey	You [indistinct 00:07:42].	7:42
Grace	You guys are very [indistinct 00:07:42] from [indistinct 00:07:42].	7:42
Bill Spivey	Look, who had idea. True. They didn't [indistinct 00:07:42].	7:42
Dorothy Spivey	Look out for your house.	7:42
Bill Spivey	Well, somebody had a [indistinct 00:07:43].	7:42
Grace	But, Bill, he could eat only once in those days. You can't eat any [indistinct 00:08:05]	7:42
Dorothy Spivey	You can't—	8:05
Bill Spivey	Both [indistinct 00:08:05] for you [indistinct 00:08:05] and go [indistinct 00:08:05].	8:05
Dorothy Spivey	And then you have nothing about [indistinct 00:08:10] this.	8:05
Bill Spivey	And never know [indistinct 00:08:10] you.	8:09
Dorothy Spivey	Maybe [indistinct 00:08:11].	8:10
Bill Spivey	That's the truth, Grace. But now, it's cholesterol. In your heart, bad [indistinct 00:08:15]. They never say about the chemicals they put on the stuff.	8:11
Grace	That's true. That's true.	8:21
Bill Spivey	She didn't never [indistinct 00:08:22] the chemicals.	8:21
Dorothy Spivey	Mmm. Mmm. Just the—	8:21
Bill Spivey	Just cholesterol. Butter, margarine, and all that stuff. And they used to make the whole butter.	8:21
Dorothy Spivey	Mm-hmm.	8:26
Bill Spivey	Take a children cake. Little they put milk [indistinct 00:08:32].	8:26
Grace	Yeah.	8:31
Bill Spivey	Drop that [indistinct 00:08:33]. But that's get harder. That will few [indistinct 00:08:36].	8:33
Grace	Mmm. Okay.	8:35
Bill Spivey	Now, they got to scratch [indistinct 00:08:39]. If [indistinct 00:08:42] too much—A few butter, they see cholesterol. If you eat margarine, cholesterol.	8:38
Grace	So, why would you eat?	8:48
Bill Spivey	Because there's [indistinct 00:08:52] not to call [indistinct 00:08:52] cholesterol. So, what you're going to eat?	8:51
Grace	[indistinct 00:08:53].	8:51
Bill Spivey	Mmm. That's the truth. And you just [indistinct 00:08:57] eat, but [indistinct 00:08:57].	8:51
Grace	Are you [indistinct 00:08:57].	8:51
Bill Spivey	It's a true, Grace. You know it's the truth. You heard, you hear it, you read about it, you see it.	8:56
Grace	I don't know it.	9:06
Bill Spivey	Cholesterol. You don't eat that, that's cholesterol. And all that, cholesterol. They didn't never say about the chemicals.	9:09
Grace	They need to come back.	9:18
Bill Spivey	Huh?	9:18
Grace	They never say—	9:19
Bill Spivey	They never say about the chemical they put on the stuff and make it grow.	9:25
Grace	Okay.	9:25
Bill Spivey	That's right. Put it on the food and make it grow. Where you know it going to right up their stuff.	9:25
Speaker 4	That's what it is.	9:27
Bill Spivey	And you go right in the school [indistinct 00:09:29] college.	9:27
Speaker 4	Right in the school.	9:27
Bill Spivey	In the Scott side [indistinct 00:09:31] is riding to leave, [indistinct 00:09:33] is going riding and it was gone.	9:27
Grace	Plain and some color green and he didn't put anything on.	9:39
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	9:40
Grace	And they had [indistinct 00:09:42]. I guess, it's coming through the soil.	9:43
Bill Spivey	Yeah, soil	9:43
Grace	No matter what you put in your fertilizer or anything, you still—	9:45
Bill Spivey	The soil	9:47
Grace	The soil is sit in from—	9:47
Dorothy Spivey	The soil. Yeah, yeah, yeah.	9:47
Grace	—the chemical [indistinct 00:09:50].	9:47
Bill Spivey	You see, there's so much mess. There was [indistinct 00:09:52] chemical. That's what it is.	9:49
Grace	I didn't tell about my stomach hurt so badly and this must be [indistinct 00:09:56].	9:52
Bill Spivey	Yeah, chemicals. That's right.	9:56
Grace	You've been in chemicals [indistinct 00:09:59].	9:58
Bill Spivey	That's right.	9:58
Grace	So, really, it's rough.	9:58
Bill Spivey	It's tough, Grace. You really know [indistinct 00:10:04] I still like it.	9:58
Grace	Uh, no. I remember Miss—I mean, Grandma Julie, which is her ambitious grandma.	10:06
Speaker 4	Her mother.	10:11
Bill Spivey	Her mother.	10:12
Grace	She used to run a little restaurant and [indistinct 00:10:15] always have food to serve.	10:12
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. Yeah. An apple Jackson, peach Jackson, food stuff like that. And [indistinct 00:10:20] nobody saying, "Hey."	10:13
Grace	Mmm, mmm. Mmm, mmm. [indistinct 00:10:23] all you want.	10:13
Bill Spivey	Eat all you want. You go [indistinct 00:10:25] eat and that's the hood.	10:13
Grace	Yeah. We eat because [indistinct 00:10:27].	10:13
Bill Spivey	Which [indistinct 00:10:27], but it didn't hurt.	10:13
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.	10:13
Grace	So, that's what amazed me about the area, of the James City area, everybody had—They knew how to survive.	10:30
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	10:37
Grace	They work by the farmers and then work with the [indistinct 00:10:44].	10:38
Bill Spivey	Beautiful. Like house or—	10:43
Grace	That's where [indistinct 00:10:44] or they cook.	10:43
Bill Spivey	They cook.	10:44
Grace	Like having a restaurant.	10:45
Bill Spivey	Uh—huh.	10:46
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:10:46].	10:46
Grace	And understand a lot pf people came from a lot of areas to look for work here.	10:48
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, at that time, I see the right way [indistinct 00:10:56] James City. You take the solo meal, [indistinct 00:11:00] gone. And then [indistinct 00:11:01] how was going. And you know what I mean. [indistinct 00:11:04] thought out and see the full [indistinct 00:11:07] how they taught our [indistinct 00:11:09] Christmas Eve about sometime in January. Really work on to about May or June.	10:52
Grace	Mm-hmm.	11:14
Bill Spivey	You what I mean?	11:14
Grace	Mm-hmm.	11:16
Bill Spivey	And by trying to get to clean it up and do because there was a crew that actually [indistinct 00:11:20] around there. But at that time, all crew get to cleaned it up [indistinct 00:11:24] it would be never [indistinct 00:11:26] stored back again. And then they probably get a little job to the meal.	11:17
Grace	Mm-hmm.	11:30
Bill Spivey	You know what I mean?	11:30
Grace	Mm-hmm.	11:31
Bill Spivey	The [indistinct 00:11:33] badges, and [indistinct 00:11:34] cards, stuff like that. So, they keep on going. And then the farms is going to thrown the [indistinct 00:11:41] alive. I gave it to them, they were survivors.	11:32
Grace	Yes. Yes. In fact, that's what has strengthened me because [indistinct 00:11:49] my goodness of these people [indistinct 00:11:50] to do so much better [indistinct 00:11:52].	11:46
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	11:51
Grace	And look at all the opportunities that was put forth today.	11:53
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	11:56
Grace	And if the young people know how to take [indistinct 00:11:57].	11:56
Bill Spivey	That's right. Mmm. Mm-hmm.	11:56
Grace	The spirit is just how they [indistinct 00:12:02].	11:57
Bill Spivey	How they—That's right. Okay.	12:18
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:12:18].	12:18
Speaker 5	Just one [indistinct 00:12:18]. And you're talking more about the folks [indistinct 00:12:18] the official [indistinct 00:12:19].	12:18
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:12:21].	12:18
Speaker 5	And I think that's [indistinct 00:12:32]. Did anything else—Did you ever heard any stories about the North Carolina [indistinct 00:12:32] actually came right [indistinct 00:12:32].	12:32
Bill Spivey	Well, I did hear a little to somebody, but I can't get that together. I did hear some about that, but I did today—The reality wasn't—I mean, no outcome about it totally.	12:32
Grace	They didn't know of that.	12:44
Bill Spivey	The way—	12:44
Grace	They came down about the [indistinct 00:12:48] from—	12:45
Bill Spivey	They come down about the land, but they were not [indistinct 00:12:50]—	12:47
Grace	They [indistinct 00:12:49].	12:48
Bill Spivey	Uh-huh.	12:48
Grace	Okay. So, let's had some [indistinct 00:12:52]. Who was that? I don't know what's [indistinct 00:12:52] had a big celebration after they came from—	12:51
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:12:59] somewhere.	12:55
Grace	[indistinct 00:13:00].	12:55
Bill Spivey	Uh-huh. No. They didn't know about—I mean, it wasn't like they have [indistinct 00:13:06] all of them had to go to jail now. But during that time, [indistinct 00:13:09] have a man. So, he didn't make [indistinct 00:13:11] going to do, like that. I guess, come down and so to speak they out [indistinct 00:13:16].	13:04
Grace	Because it's getting pretty hard. All right.	13:17
Bill Spivey	Getting pretty hard. All right. [indistinct 00:13:19] me. Pretty [indistinct 00:13:22] bridge, plus all that [indistinct 00:13:23].	13:18
Grace	Well, I tell you, Mr. Olsen has heard enough about James City, just [indistinct 00:13:30] themselves just by everyone we have spoken to, they have mentioned how James City would keeping—take care of itself from the outside.	13:23
Bill Spivey	Yes. Yes.	13:41
Grace	It's like a closer to family.	13:48
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	13:48
Grace	[indistinct 00:13:49].	13:48
Bill Spivey	And like I say, during that time, but even my time, they will respect, Grace, in our hood. My dad and bluebird—	13:48
Grace	I don't think they have—They have a lot [indistinct 00:13:57] talking about.	13:56
Bill Spivey	—and all, they all belong together. They're all [indistinct 00:14:01] at all, but they have respect.	13:57
Grace	Yes. Mm-hmm.	14:03
Bill Spivey	I've been up here a minute time, I've been back at the house and go home [indistinct 00:14:09] by dog. [indistinct 00:14:11] folks go up here [indistinct 00:14:13] drinking liquor.	14:05
Grace	Mm-hmm.	14:14
Bill Spivey	And they didn't want to see me.	14:14
Grace	Mm-hmm. Understand.	14:15
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:14:16] be on a real show [indistinct 00:14:18]. You know that idea that [indistinct 00:14:22] done about the fact. Cut [indistinct 00:14:24] creek. And go through [indistinct 00:14:26] and go home. But the one lady says, "I don't care. When? [indistinct 00:14:31] morning. [indistinct 00:14:31]."	14:17
Grace	No, we see.	14:30
Bill Spivey	"That would you know, Ma'am. That wasn't me." "A lie. That was you." No, Ma'am. I have been there the previous week." A lie. That get [indistinct 00:14:42] evening. But, I mean, that was respect.	14:32
Grace	Yeah.	14:45
Bill Spivey	You take right back over here where are. That [indistinct 00:14:53] she got house sitting right over there and back there for the [indistinct 00:14:57]. Go back and [indistinct 00:14:58] stay a little bit long. So, I [indistinct 00:15:00]. But [indistinct 00:15:01].	14:47
Grace	[indistinct 00:15:01] when she enjoy this [indistinct 00:15:04].	15:02
Bill Spivey	Enjoy that was definitely [indistinct 00:15:04]. [indistinct 00:15:05] go home, go up there, come to the cemetery. And there was a snake [indistinct 00:15:13] the other [indistinct 00:15:13] night. [indistinct 00:15:13] go to river and go home. But I mean, we would highly give you respect. Not to get [indistinct 00:15:16] y'all.	15:03
Grace	They have [indistinct 00:15:19] any. Almost have to call the sheriff [indistinct 00:15:20].	15:18
Bill Spivey	Yeah. In the local [indistinct 00:15:21]. And I'm just, "Get over. What's going on?" And it took [indistinct 00:15:31] on me.	15:19
Grace	Yes [indistinct 00:15:31].	15:31
Bill Spivey	You go [indistinct 00:15:31] been. But that was respect. [indistinct 00:15:31] around a minute and back head [indistinct 00:15:31] and see them coming up here and go [indistinct 00:15:33].	15:31
Grace	Okay.	15:36
Bill Spivey	Military [indistinct 00:15:36], but [indistinct 00:15:36] a lot of bullet. All right. [indistinct 00:15:38]. I don't know. So, that's [indistinct 00:15:48], Grace.	15:36
Grace	Mm-hmm. [indistinct 00:15:48] enjoy.	15:47
Bill Spivey	Best [indistinct 00:15:48].	15:47
Grace	But you enjoy [indistinct 00:15:50].	15:47
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:15:50].	15:47
Grace	I'm just having a bal l with Mrs. Olsen going around here and these stories and I'm just laughing. I was like—	15:54
Bill Spivey	Well, it's true. I mean, it's really—	15:54
Grace	Because it's a lot of—To hear the stories and telling everybody has a different stories to tell.	15:54
Bill Spivey	Well, it's just like you're talking [indistinct 00:16:06] back. Most of them [indistinct 00:16:10] have little [indistinct 00:16:11], which will change [indistinct 00:16:11].	16:04
Grace	Mm-hmm.	16:11
Bill Spivey	Now, if you want some [indistinct 00:16:15], just go out and then [indistinct 00:16:18] to go. And then we'll call and let's [indistinct 00:16:22] being they come up like that.	16:14
Grace	The [indistinct 00:16:23].	16:23
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:16:23]. You want to show [indistinct 00:16:24] and like, "Okay. And get some [indistinct 00:16:27]. Okay." And then go.	16:23
Grace	Mm-hmm. You [indistinct 00:16:30] selfish.	16:23
Bill Spivey	You want to [indistinct 00:16:30] selfish. I can [indistinct 00:16:33], everybody want to speak, got a piece of [indistinct 00:16:37]. You know what I mean?	16:32
Grace	Yes.	16:38
Bill Spivey	Everybody got a [indistinct 00:16:39]. Everybody can get a piece of [indistinct 00:16:43].	16:38
Grace	Yeah. I remember even [indistinct 00:16:46] was killing a [indistinct 00:16:48] in that [indistinct 00:16:50] got a piece.	16:47
Bill Spivey	Everybody got a piece. That's right.	16:51
Grace	Different [indistinct 00:16:51].	16:51
Bill Spivey	Get a piece. That's right. It was times [indistinct 00:16:58] money certainly not. I really [indistinct 00:17:00].	16:51
Grace	No. I think that is the problem.	16:57
Bill Spivey	And most of that—	16:57
Grace	The more money, the people became more selfish.	16:57
Bill Spivey	More selfish.	16:57
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah.	16:57
Bill Spivey	That's right.	16:57
Grace	Yeah. And when I used to walk even in my time, everybody spoke.	17:08
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	17:11
Grace	You could not pass anybody without saying, "Good morning."	17:11
Bill Spivey	Good morning, good evening, good—And how are you.	17:14
Grace	Or how [indistinct 00:17:20].	17:20
Bill Spivey	Then like I said, good way of [indistinct 00:17:20].	17:20
Grace	Yeah. Your way.	17:20
Bill Spivey	You do like that. Your way.	17:20
Grace	But today, they turn their heads before you can even say, "Good morning," or whatever.	17:20
Bill Spivey	Say what do you know. Sure. No. Good evening. No. Let's go out and [indistinct 00:17:25].	17:21
Grace	Yeah.	17:21
Bill Spivey	Right in your house.	17:21
Grace	Yes.	17:21
Bill Spivey	They come right [indistinct 00:17:28] house, they [indistinct 00:17:28] ride on bike.	17:21
Grace	Will not speak [indistinct 00:17:30].	17:21
Bill Spivey	Kicking [indistinct 00:17:30] over there, which [indistinct 00:17:31] I would. It's not going to [indistinct 00:17:33] not been there. [indistinct 00:17:33] you a good morning, how are you all, something like that.	17:34
Grace	That's a really good speak.	17:35
Bill Spivey	Yeah, that's right.	17:35
Grace	And if you did, somebody wish you and let somebody else know your family. She don't speak, she don't even smile. So, they—Those days, I don't know what happened in between there. So much little progress. I have no ideas. No ideas.	17:43
Bill Spivey	I don't know what Grace is talk.	17:55
Grace	[indistinct 00:17:58]. In reference to the cemetery, did you—I know [indistinct 00:18:04] slaves [indistinct 00:18:06].	17:58
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. Yeah. They left. Mm-hmm.	18:07
Grace	But I understand, there were other cemeteries located in [indistinct 00:18:12].	18:08
Bill Spivey	Well, there was one. The Moon Road, it go down this way and move into that. That was the cemetery there.	18:13
Grace	Mm-hmm.	18:23
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:18:25].	18:23
Bill Spivey	I don't know who [indistinct 00:18:27] back over there with [indistinct 00:18:32]. You've [indistinct 00:18:32] back over in that way [indistinct 00:18:32] 200-meter. But it was the cemetery there.	18:26
Grace	Now, we talking the water here, right?	18:35
Bill Spivey	Mmm?	18:37
Grace	In James City. Old James City.	18:38
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	18:39
Grace	Is that near to water? There's a for sale sign near that bridge. On the opposite side with the [indistinct 00:18:48] comes over—	18:40
Bill Spivey	Just way over here. But I don't know—What the name of cemetery. Not in there, as I know anything about.	18:49
Grace	I'm [indistinct 00:18:57] pointing out [indistinct 00:18:58]—	18:54
Dorothy Spivey	I'm trying to pitch you with—	18:58
Bill Spivey	There was one—Let's see if you're going new, but now if you don't take a little [indistinct 00:19:06] take the rule to go into that short bridge—	19:02
Grace	In downtown.	19:08
Bill Spivey	—it was cemetery [indistinct 00:19:10].	19:09
Grace	That's I think the problem.	19:12
Bill Spivey	And I think that road go right across the top of that cemetery—over that cemetery.	19:12
Grace	That's what I'm talking about.	19:13
Bill Spivey	That's what your talking about?	19:15
Grace	Mm-hmm.	19:15
Bill Spivey	But it wasn't the actual cemetery there.	19:16
Grace	Okay.	19:16
Bill Spivey	Now, I don't know—I pull my time—	19:17
Grace	That cemetery I'm talking about	19:20
Bill Spivey	—for the [indistinct 00:19:21] stones there, but good [indistinct 00:19:23]. But it was a cemetery there.	19:21
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:19:27].	19:25
Grace	Was the one we make be about that part on the other side of the Scotts Creek. Now, we're already in James City Park, but it come up when you right across Scotts Creek way—	19:26
Speaker 4	What his name—	19:37
Grace	It's a concrete bridge there when I was a little girl. There was a cemetery somewhere on that side behind a [indistinct 00:19:45], behind a house, something like that.	19:38
Bill Spivey	So, we remember house of [indistinct 00:19:48]—	19:46
Grace	I used to be.	19:46
Bill Spivey	But that's what—	19:46
Grace	But that's [indistinct 00:19:50]. That's the [indistinct 00:19:51] come.	19:46
Bill Spivey	I know you feel a little affective, concern, I said this feeling [indistinct 00:19:55] fact. I don't know what you're [indistinct 00:19:56].	19:51
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah.	19:55
Speaker 4	Okay. I remember seeing stones there.	19:55
Dorothy Spivey	That's right.	19:55
Bill Spivey	You remember the stones.	19:55
Grace	Okay.	19:55
Bill Spivey	Stone there and everything. I remember part of the wall there.	19:55
Grace	Yeah.	19:55
Bill Spivey	But I don't know—I've never seen those sign on cemetery over there.	20:03
Grace	Okay. Maybe that's what I saw. But the cemetery was on the other side.	20:05
Bill Spivey	On the side of the creek.	20:08
Grace	An old James City.	20:08
Bill Spivey	Old James City.	20:08
Grace	Okay.	20:09
Bill Spivey	Uh-huh.	20:10
Grace	And so, that was a [indistinct 00:20:12] fact.	20:11
Bill Spivey	You say that was a [indistinct 00:20:13] fact because—	20:12
Grace	But you should be clear [indistinct 00:20:15] see stones.	20:12
Bill Spivey	Uh-huh. The stones really part of the wall, but that was a [indistinct 00:20:18] part of [indistinct 00:20:19] where boys, people back down. It was the boys play baseball back down there. I don't know I found a cemetery in there.	20:17
Grace	Bill, let me [indistinct 00:20:30], but they used to have a band here and a sport—	20:29
Bill Spivey	Sure, yeah. Yeah.	20:35
Grace	A baseball team.	20:43
Bill Spivey	Yeah, yeah. A baseball team, yeah. [indistinct 00:20:44] James City [indistinct 00:20:45] all of that. We had a club band and had a baseball team. I remember a little about the baseball team, but I remember a lot about the band. Andy Johnson got a picture.	20:44
Grace	She did.	20:51
Bill Spivey	I don't know if [indistinct 00:20:52] about the baseball boy	20:52
Grace	Oh, yeah.	20:58
Bill Spivey	Uh-huh. Baseball team [indistinct 00:21:11], my dad, and bluebird, and John [indistinct 00:21:11].	21:10
Grace	Oh, my God. I should tell my mother to me there.	21:10
Bill Spivey	And when you go to the US—	21:10
Grace	I'll change it.	21:10
Bill Spivey	—they will see you.	21:10
Grace	Oh, certainly.	21:10
Bill Spivey	No. I think that was magic.	21:10
Grace	All right.	21:10
Bill Spivey	And Jim Moe—	21:10
Grace	I totally forgot.	21:10
Bill Spivey	—bluebird, my daddy—	21:11
Dorothy Spivey	No, that's [indistinct 00:21:13] to me.	21:12
Bill Spivey	—Chris, Russel, Gumbo Harris, and [indistinct 00:21:24]. I think I'll be picking on that.	21:12
Dorothy Spivey	Keep that.	21:24
Bill Spivey	Uh-huh. By hand, I got to pick you.	21:27
Grace	Oh, okay. I'll give you [indistinct 00:21:30].	21:28
Bill Spivey	All baseball Joe Jayson. The baseball team.	21:30
Grace	Old James City baseball team.	21:31
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, where all that [indistinct 00:21:32] average in their head.	21:31
Grace	Well, I'm sure.	21:31
Bill Spivey	And they have [indistinct 00:21:35].	21:31
Speaker 4	No, I'm [indistinct 00:21:35] respect.	21:31
Bill Spivey	It's [indistinct 00:21:36].	21:31
Grace	Huh?	21:31
Bill Spivey	The name of the team was [indistinct 00:21:38].	21:37
Grace	Isn't that something [indistinct 00:21:41]?	21:38
Bill Spivey	And you go by [indistinct 00:21:42] she will show you the pictures.	21:42
Grace	Certainly, we love the [indistinct 00:21:44].	21:43
Bill Spivey	And you can see—I mean, it's really there.	21:43
Speaker 4	Because [indistinct 00:21:46] love it if you put that up, James and his team.	21:43
Bill Spivey	I wish it really knew. And then—	21:50
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:21:51].	21:50
Bill Spivey	—add [indistinct 00:21:52] play for the [indistinct 00:21:54].	21:50
Grace	[indistinct 00:21:54]?	21:50
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:21:55]. The name of team was [indistinct 00:21:57]. But they ended up, it was magic.	21:55
Grace	Okay. Okay. I hope our children didn't come and take [indistinct 00:22:03].	22:00
Bill Spivey	Okay. Yeah, that's the truth.	22:03
Grace	Sometimes they—The different ones when a whole [indistinct 00:22:07].	22:04
Bill Spivey	That the old boy, they all [indistinct 00:22:08]. Jim Sean, bluebirds, my dad.	22:09
Grace	Okay.	22:12
Bill Spivey	Oh, Lord. A lot of—Zach Grimes.	22:12
Grace	Yeah. I saw that [indistinct 00:22:19] Dr. Peppers. And the band, I guess, that was—Who will [indistinct 00:22:26]?	22:19
Bill Spivey	The [indistinct 00:22:26].	22:24
Grace	Very [indistinct 00:22:28].	22:24
Bill Spivey	My granddaddy. Sam, Joel. Not Alfred, but [indistinct 00:22:39] it doesn't [indistinct 00:22:40], but he'll leave.	22:33
Grace	Okay. And—	22:40
Bill Spivey	That old [indistinct 00:22:42] will leave. And a grateful [indistinct 00:22:45] I can call them about [indistinct 00:22:46].	22:44
Grace	Honestly. Honestly.	22:44
Dorothy Spivey	What's the name of the band?	22:45
Bill Spivey	They did have a band.	22:48
Grace	But the band, what was the name of the band at James City? Well, just to know.	22:51
Bill Spivey	Well, they have name, hood, but I can't right now.	22:55
Grace	Honestly. So, we would call it James and the band.	22:56
Bill Spivey	James and the band.	22:59
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:23:00].	22:59
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. That's right. You guys had a band.	22:59
Grace	Uh-huh.	22:59
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	22:59
Grace	Yeah. From what I hear, you had everything.	23:04
Bill Spivey	I had everything.	23:06
Grace	You had everything.	23:06
Bill Spivey	Yes.	23:06
Grace	And it's amazing how it all just died out.	23:08
Bill Spivey	Yeah.	23:11
Grace	Somewhere along the way, some generation just skip right over.	23:12
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	23:15
Grace	Looking for change.	23:15
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	23:16
Grace	And you had it all.	23:18
Bill Spivey	That's right.	23:19
Grace	Just need to improve.	23:19
Bill Spivey	Improve, that's right.	23:21
Grace	[indistinct 00:23:22]. Well, this is going to be very interesting because just like it's all—I'm learning every day. To have this recorded and help young people to know that this is how it was.	23:24
Bill Spivey	That's right.	23:35
Grace	That make us strength, right there.	23:36
Bill Spivey	That's right.	23:37
Grace	In fact, James City seemed it was driving also the new room.	23:37
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. And don't let them head it back. Then [indistinct 00:23:50] never like New Orleans.	23:37
Grace	Okay.	23:37
Bill Spivey	Somebody pass the band with—Going to the cemetery.	23:52
Grace	Oh, all right.	23:53
Bill Spivey	And [indistinct 00:23:55] they will coming back. You know what I mean?	23:54
Grace	All right. I know, I've heard that.	23:54
Bill Spivey	You played the march going—To feel the march [indistinct 00:23:55].	23:54
Grace	Yeah. Uh-huh. Uh-huh.	23:54
Bill Spivey	Feel the march [indistinct 00:23:55], but oh, Lord.	23:54
Grace	[indistinct 00:23:55] dancing coming back.	23:54
Bill Spivey	Coming back to [indistinct 00:23:55], baby.	23:54
Grace	Yeah.	23:54
Bill Spivey	Yeah, that's right.	23:54
Grace	Yeah. That—	23:54
Bill Spivey	Yeah, sure. And they are all—	23:54
Grace	It's [indistinct 00:23:55] good to hear.	23:54
Bill Spivey	And don't like the little function going on like that, the band.	23:54
Grace	The band.	23:54
Bill Spivey	Just like those [indistinct 00:24:21] about going out. The band. And the riverboat is good.	23:54
Grace	The riverboat.	24:24
Bill Spivey	Yeah. Riverboat is good.	24:29
Grace	Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. The band.	24:29
Bill Spivey	James and the band.	24:31
Grace	Oh, it's amazing.	24:32
Bill Spivey	That's right. It was amazing. That's right.	24:32
Speaker 4	[indistinct 00:24:34]. I'd love to be back there. It seems like, more fun than now.	24:34
Bill Spivey	[indistinct 00:24:34] what? Well, that's the truth.	24:34
Dorothy Spivey	So, [indistinct 00:24:42] now.	24:34
Grace	Now, is scary.	24:34
Dorothy Spivey	There's so much tragedy [indistinct 00:24:47].	24:44
Grace	So, Bill, what would they do? Everybody would take their own food, the baskets of food, or what? What would happen when they go on [indistinct 00:24:53]?	24:46
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, yeah.	24:51
Bill Spivey	Well, see, they carried their—	24:51
Dorothy Spivey	Yes, they would take fully the—	24:51
Bill Spivey	—old basket going to [indistinct 00:24:58].	24:51
Dorothy Spivey	Some in baskets or boxes.	24:59
Bill Spivey	Boxes. But they had the whole food.	24:59
Dorothy Spivey	Yeah.	25:01
Grace	They will got [indistinct 00:25:02] .	25:01
Bill Spivey	They had the whole food and cook all. And it's good to see. We're leaving on the Thursday, they started cooking about Tuesday.	25:01
Grace	Yeah.	25:08
Bill Spivey	They cook Tuesday and Wednesday and then a lot of boxes and stuff, good food.	25:10
Grace	Yeah.	25:14
Bill Spivey	Yeah. They had time. That's right.	25:15
Grace	Bill, when you were a little boy, what kind of games can you remember what you did? What kind of games did you play?	25:18
Bill Spivey	Baseball, marble.	25:23
Grace	Mm-hmm. Marble.	25:24
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	25:24
Grace	Mm-hmm.	25:25
Bill Spivey	Hide and seek, all that stuff.	25:26
Dorothy Spivey	And I see [indistinct 00:25:27] on the end of the day. I don't know if I did? What they call it, straw-ride?	25:27
Bill Spivey	No. I never been on a straw-ride.	25:38
Dorothy Spivey	Do you remember [indistinct 00:25:41], I don't think I did.	25:40
Bill Spivey	No. I never did go on hayride.	25:41
Dorothy Spivey	But are they still on top of my [indistinct 00:25:44] head, but would you let me go. But they have straw-ride with his wagon with—	25:43
Grace	Straw.	25:46
Dorothy Spivey	—a horse [indistinct 00:25:52] and pull the ride.	25:47
Bill Spivey	Yeah. It was great we had baseball game.	25:56
Dorothy Spivey	[indistinct 00:25:58].	25:57
Bill Spivey	Marbles game and hide and seek. All kind of games, like that. Foot races. [indistinct 00:26:06] in that corner, that corner.	25:59
Grace	Most of this was centered around the churches?	26:09
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm.	26:12
Grace	The church?	26:12
Bill Spivey	Mm-hmm. Churches have.	26:13
Grace	Have this.	26:13
Bill Spivey	And churches have been pick [indistinct 00:26:16] like team James.	26:13
Grace	Now, I really do appreciate you guys.	26:13
Bill Spivey	Thank you.	26:13
Grace	You want to say anything else?	26:13
Bill Spivey	Well, that was [indistinct 00:26:25].	26:13
Grace	[indistinct 00:26:25] good, really. We could just come and just talk. I just enjoyed talking about it, reminisce.	26:27
Dorothy Spivey	Sometime, you do it by going, so close some people. You need my late husband, night long.	26:32
Grace	Okay.	26:37
Dorothy Spivey	He had memory like an [indistinct 00:26:39].	26:37
Grace	Okay. Okay.	26:37
Dorothy Spivey	And [indistinct 00:26:41]. She is not around like father.	26:42
Grace	Okay, I know.	26:43
Dorothy Spivey	Oh, her memories—	26:43
Grace	So, Ms. Ed—What's her name, Ms—?	26:43
Dorothy Spivey	Annie.	26:47
Grace	Yeah. I'm so reminisce that she passed [indistinct 00:26:51].	26:48
Dorothy Spivey	A year, I don't remember the date, but I was able to tell it by year in this place, November. Am I right, dear?	26:52
Bill Spivey	Right.	26:57
Dorothy Spivey	But I think [indistinct 00:27:00] days.	26:57
Bill Spivey	About that.	26:57
Dorothy Spivey	November this [indistinct 00:27:05].	27:04
Grace	Yeah. That why we never [indistinct 00:27:06].	27:05
Dorothy Spivey	She had good memory too. Better than mine.	27:05
Grace	Okay. So, we try to get his memory because we can [indistinct 00:27:13]. Such a beautiful stories to be told. Okay.	27:08

Item Info

Title:

Dorothy Spivey (primary interviewee) and Bill Spivey interview recording, circa 1993-1997

Date:

1993-1997~

Creator:

Description:

Name: Dorothy Spivey; Date of birth: unknown; Place of birth: unknown; Occupation(s): unknown; Residence: not recorded
Informant ID: 351; Informant ID: 352.

Location:

Format:

Language:

English

Digital Collection:

Behind the Veil

Source Collection:

Behind the Veil: Documenting African American Life in the Jim Crow South interviews, photographs, and project records, circa 1864-2011, bulk 1990-1999

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Provenance:

The David M. Rubenstein Rare Book and Manuscript Library acquired the Records of the Behind the Veil Oral History Project from the Duke University Center for Documentary Studies in 1997, 1998, 2000, and 2002.

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Limited Re-Use

CC BY-NC 4.0

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Copyright for content created by the Behind the Veil project is held by Duke University and made available to the public using a Creative Commons Attribution / Non-commercial (CC-BY-NC) license.

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Interview number: 447
56fbf10b-6b1a-4485-84b5-b29eaacc5f9f
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Dorothy Spivey (primary interviewee) and Bill Spivey interview recording, circa 1993-1997

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John Hope Franklin Research Center

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